developer blog (kind of)

[cdoublejj]

can you tell me details about the cars you downloaded?
where you found them, who is the author, etc.
the main problem with the models from other games btw is that their engine bays are for example not modeled.

i apologize i'm off base this comment. while that's totally cool for the time being, eventually for stuff that makes it in to the final game we have to either make it our selves and or have documentation of agreement.

I still remember some of the conversations and things Hellmark said over the years about such legalities ESPECIALLY with car damage and damage effects. (nothing like getting sued by GM or Ford and shut down before you even know what happened.

I have searched for addon cars for games where I see a screenshot or video of the car and its engine + engine bay...

Suitable cars are then downloaded,

then I check for the ORIGINAL authors contact information and delete the rest,

after this I test what cars can be imported and what cars are locked, the locked cars are deleted,

finally I contact the original authors using EMAIL of the remaning cars and

If I get permissions from authors I then save the email and takes a screenshot of the permission for documentation.

I already have one car that has made it through my selection process.

It is a 1972 Mercury Monterey 2DR Resonably high poly, originally made for GTA 4.
I have the original authors permission on email to modify and use this car for SR3.

I also found some old max files of a more recent version of the 1932 ford custom, as well as the email where I was granted permission to use it for whatever purpose I wished by its original author. That car was originally made for NFS 4.

When these 2 cars have been prepared a bit more then they should be very nice test cars for experiments in irrlicht, unity, halflife engine and other game engines

Very good! Sometime we will have to start archiving this stuff. maybe we can use a file sharing service like mega with PW protection or maybe if needed i can setup an FTP on my server or something, so every one can share the files and dependent on one persons HDD like the time Hellmark's crashed.

[megariffer]

It is a 1972 Mercury Monterey 2DR Resonably high poly, originally made for GTA 4.
I have the original authors permission on email to modify and use this car for SR3.

I also found some old max files of a more recent version of the 1932 frod custom, as well as the email where I was granted permission to use it for whatever purpose I wished by its orginal author. That car was originally made for NFS 4.

When these 2 cars have been prepared a bit more then they should be very nice test cars for experiments in irrlicht, unity, halflife engine and other game engines

do you have the model for the car, too? because gta4 files are always locked, so we can't access the model in it. i already had that problem, the author agreed that we can modify the car, but he didn't have the model file, only the gta4 wft file, and since it was locked, i couldn't use it.

also, there are a lot of models out there that were just ripped/remodeled from other games, or stolen from other modelers. that's very common in the GTA community (that's why most of the scratch modelers left the community 4-5 years ago).
i know the Mercury Monterey is not one of those, Driver was a modeler in the GCU community, he modeled that car. if you have the model, please send it to me, and i'll use it in unity.

about the engine: you don't have to experiment with anything else than Unity, in fact, you don't have to experiment with anything, as i'm doing all the work in the engine. if you want to help, then try and get more models from the guys out there, as it's a very time consuming task, and i don't have the time for that.

[Maxaxle]

do you have the model for the car, too? because gta4 files are always locked, so we can't access the model in it.

Hmmmm, you tried OpenIV, right?

[megariffer]

do you have the model for the car, too? because gta4 files are always locked, so we can't access the model in it.

Hmmmm, you tried OpenIV, right?

tell me if i'm mistaken, but as far as i know, OpenIV is just for opening GTA images, so you can extract the content from the game, but you can't "crack" a locked wft file with it. if you can do that, PM me, i have APEC's permission to use his 67 impala.

[Maxaxle]

Hmmmm. I know GTA4 vehicle files have indeed been extracted from the game files before, since there are a fair number of Garry's Mod vehicles that use them.

Example:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jdGh4FLtv30

More recent example: the SCars addon for Garry's Mod.
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=104487316
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=104492363

[megariffer]

Hmmmm. I know GTA4 vehicle files have indeed been extracted from the game files before, since there are a fair number of Garry's Mod vehicles that use them.

Example:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jdGh4FLtv30

More recent example: the SCars addon for Garry's Mod.
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=104487316
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=104492363

not every models are locked. you can lock them with zmodeler, so there is a fair amount of unlocked GTAIV vehicles, including the original cars in the game. but if the file was locked in zmodeler, there is no way unlocking it, as far as i know. everything could be cracked though, but i'm not interested in it that much, to find out.
also, i'm developing the game in a way that people can add their cars later to the game (modding), so maybe, if the game is succesful enough, we're gonna have plenty of cars anyway.

[cdoublejj]

that's good and important thing to do. one of the things that made Gear Head Garage what it was, was the community and the content it made. it got boring after some time not being able to race the cars though.

[megariffer]

hello everybody!

i'm having a hard time gathering content for the game, i'm short on good 3d models unfortunately.
the GRID2 garage had to go, so i decided to create a new one just for SR3.
i was using the old SR3 garage as a base, and spent the weekend on re-editing the model and placing objects all over the place. it starts to look OK, but there is still some work to do. i'll post some screens later this week.

i also got some engine part models from our good friend FLED, so there is two new engines in the game, now totaling at 3: Chrysler 'B' engine 383 and 440 and a mopar Chrysler LA 340
the B engines come with a few 4brl carb choices, and a six pack.
i took the carb and the air filter apart, so you will be able to change the look of the filters.
there are 3 pie pan choices currently, plain black, super commando, and magnum.

right now i'm waiting for the release of the vehicle physics engine, i hope it will be finished in a few weeks, maybe months. i'll be using Edy's new physics engine, quite cleverly named 'Vehicle Physics Pro'.

i'm also thinking i'll be releasing a playable demo without racing game mechanics soon, where you can try  out buying and changing parts in the new garage.

stay tuned for more!

oh, and if anyone knows any good 3d modelers, don't hesitate to share their contacts with me!
i have paying work as well, i'm not only looking for volunteers!

[cdoublejj]

are trying to get the poly count up on purpose? other wise i'd say it doesn't really matter since your still fleshing things out.

Sr3 used to get 3d models volunteering all the time. once things get moving i'd maybe guess that will be the case again back then our bottle neck was lack of programmers.

any thing your looking for in particular? i might possibly be able to help out.

[megariffer]

this is not a question of polycount, it's a question of quality.
i don't want to release shit, not even at pre-pre-pre-alpha stage.

right now i'm not very optimistic about 3d modelers rushing the project, things were different back in 2000.

yes, i have many particularities in mind, if you want to hear more about it, pm me in IRC

[cdoublejj]

this is not a question of polycount, it's a question of quality.
i don't want to release shit, not even at pre-pre-pre-alpha stage.

right now i'm not very optimistic about 3d modelers rushing the project, things were different back in 2000.

yes, i have many particularities in mind, if you want to hear more about it, pm me in IRC

well if you wanna do it RIGHT. A garage model that is were gonna have to start to start scratch. first of all we want some something period correct, something one of the the garage i have seen to date do. 2nd ly we need textures and content that won't get us sued. 3rd for all the trouble it should look good.

it's so much of tall order but, tedious and i think it's totally doable. we need to ask our selves questions.

what of garage would it be? why so? what would be in it? why? what kind of 3d standards? what kind of textures? what resolution/sizes of textures? bump mapping? Poly limit?

Personally i find this all very interesting and maybe fun. I feel some of the research i've done of the years about the period answers some of these questions and my time on the forums answers some others seeing discussions and what not.

This could be a very fun/cool model to do!!!

[megariffer]

as a matter of fact, I already started making the garage, here are a few shots:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/0g54njw8he2z4k8/AAAjy7fzyA87eNs6Sck9t_-va?dl=0

EDIT:
also, I'd like to add that the first race track is in the works.

[cdoublejj]

good start but, i'm gonna be mean and beat you up now. the castorl oil jug from the old garage is too new. the gas cans are too new, the VIS-SW 40 is too new. the battery is too new, one of the wrench sets is too new. the windows aren't correct style for an American home of that period. some of proportions on some things are off. some parts of the garage are too cluttered. no ceiling.

that said NOT BAD MY FRIEND!!! VERY Solid start! The last time i booted up z modeler i just drew blanks because it's been so darned long since i used it.

A good way to start out would be to consider to home/garage styles popular of the era, then start hunting for truly freely available textures and study the anatomy of period correct garage. At which point i'd do what i did with original sr3 garage revamp i did, which would be to study portions of the materials like brick and 2x4s, get the walls and floors going then decides if the ceiling is going to be trusses or filled in which would go hand in hand for what ever type of construction style was used back then.

the homes back then would be form the 50s and 60s, something common from the boom after world war 2.

building/architecture styles are some things i've been researching the past year or 3. I've also begun researching stuff like car dealerships and popular racing spots of the time. i've even collected pictures and web pages that i have been saving to my local hard drive. I need to start pulling my SR3 project files from my old hard drive. my windows installation started giving up the ghost and i have since backed up and clean installed. i need to get my project files loaded back up on my machine.

[megariffer]

yeah, you do that.
i've been hearing about the loads of period correct reference photos you've been gathering, though i've never seen a single one yet.
i've never been to the US before so you might have a head start deciding what is period correct and what's not.
if you want to make a new garage, feel free to do so. we can fill it with the objects from this garage which you think are OK for the game. also you should understand that i can't wait for you, i want to make something playable soon.
if the biggest problem with the game will be a not authentic castrol oil jug, i'll be well damn satisfied.
since you were so honest with me, allow me to say that i don't have any hopes about you helping as you have done literally nothing in the past 3 years to help the project.
i really appreciate the work you put into keeping the flame of SR3 alive, withou you the game might have been forgotten by now.
but if you think you want to make this game better, do it already.

[cdoublejj]

yeah, you do that.
i've been hearing about the loads of period correct reference photos you've been gathering, though i've never seen a single one yet.
i've never been to the US before so you might have a head start deciding what is period correct and what's not.
if you want to make a new garage, feel free to do so. we can fill it with the objects from this garage which you think are OK for the game. also you should understand that i can't wait for you, i want to make something playable soon.
if the biggest problem with the game will be a not authentic castrol oil jug, i'll be well damn satisfied.
since you were so honest with me, allow me to say that i don't have any hopes about you helping as you have done literally nothing in the past 3 years to help the project.
i really appreciate the work you put into keeping the flame of SR3 alive, withou you the game might have been forgotten by now.
but if you think you want to make this game better, do it already.

So this is what it feels like to be a liar. i though i had more, i though i had save some HTML files talking about places like bob's donut(s) and some black and whites of dealer ship that even had the same model of car i have new. so untill i can speak with action i'm a liar for now. i did pull a little bit of what i thought i had. even some SUPPOSEDLY free textures i found on "free texture sites". i'm the pessimistic type so i assume since it's been so long and because none of them came with legal contracts that we can sued for their use. 

https://mega.co.nz/#F!n4gUFDLC!F5UjE6Uj9esptZveboOsPA

https://mega.co.nz/#F!ypwjESKT!3upBX4yvfBOL7vCaAqcEng

it's not much if any thing at all. I still think i remember more. i thought i had pulled screens from a game called call of duty, there is map of a 1950s /1960s town the garage models had some good details mainly of the ceilings and trusses. maybe if i did some more maybe i have these files.


EDIT: you know i've been thinking about what you said. you were saying having a game with the wrong oil jug would be the least of worries. and it is and that was mentality of the old dev group not because they didn't care about the details but, because these things can be changed alter. every thing in the old alpha was a place holder. At the time all coding was done manually the biggest issue was physics and the ability to config files for car parts.

you said it was question of quality, even pre-pre-alpha but, does it matter? if it's gonna be change later anyways? wouldn't make more sense to focus on things like making it possible to bolt and unbolt and parts or make the suspension parts affect handling? or is it matter of testing file format and textures and size scaling?

perhaps i'm exacerbating things it's true i've never been developer and i made some models once and i failed miserable to grasp 3ds max 2010 with the lynda.com training videos. most 3d modelers except you to have table and be good at drawing and zmodeler gets limited when you want make certain shapes but, maybe i'm making excuses maybe i'm lazy or stupid or something. i used to spend so much more time on this project and now i just i wish i could take sleeping pills after work and just sleep. non of that changes the fact that all i do is talk (mostly negative) and not do.

I'd apologize for not being more hospitable it seems i'm one to rain on every ones parade like a dick head or ass hole. (one of things i liked about the old community [in a way]) I don't think that would help or make any one happy.

What might help is if i can re aquanted with 3d modeling and see if i can manage any hing half decent (i doubt it). One of the walls i'm hitting is with more advanced modelers like 3ds max is that it's made for every thing verticies modeling. or modeling styles of all kinds but, my own. i self taught, my method is to take primitives and manipute, re-size, scale and manipulate the vertices and zanoza is good for this style but, more complex shapes like corner of a 50s dinner roof require sculpting some shape can't be made with vertices manipulation or primitives.

so far the only 2 models i have tried are zanoza and 3ds max 2010, i used g modeler back in the day but, it's super old and limited now too. i have not tried blender. one thing the more advanced modeler can do i bump mapping, i'm not if zanoza modeler can or not. i struggle with advanced modelers they many buttons too many buttons. making primitive is like a 15 step process it seems, unless you can draw it out on a tablet. another thing is due to my method it's usually low or low-ish poly count. idk if i'm capable of grasping a new sculpting or nurbs method for higher poly modeling. that may be some work i could if it doesn't require a shit ton of dedicated time.

...any ways, just installed zanoza, gonna see if i can force myself to baby step towards some modeling and or do some more research. i'll stop typing for now.