StreetRod 3 forums

Street Rod 3 => Development => Topic started by: TSJ on July 15, 2014, 02:48:50 pm

Title: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on July 15, 2014, 02:48:50 pm
I have just now created a very simple garage for further testing purposes with a mouse controlled main camera... I was wondering what we would need to have in the garage... this list is composed of stuff I've seen in the SR1,2 and Alpha version of SR3 as well as some of my own ideers...

ladder
car door
fire extingisher
posters
window
car tires
wrench
engine tuner
large hammer
car lift/under the car board/car jack
book
clock on wall
radio
tire stack
car paint spray thing
newspaper
alcohol
jerry cans
cardboard boxes
hamper
lots of smaller cans
desk/chest of drawers
fan
engine parts
tool plate on wall
car sign
paint cans
parts list
metal locker
drill
hand drill machine
4 way tire iron
tire rubber hose
harley
lamp
lots of shelves
posters
calender
switch
open garage door with highes
bucket
plants
table
tuning device

Currently my test scene has this...

table
wrench
drill
plants
jerry can
tire stack
tuning device
clock
car lift
test car

I have yet to write any code at all... It is only a stationary scene at this point...
I have had problems making some 3d models show up "in-game" whle others show u without problems... I have yet to find out why :)
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on July 18, 2014, 06:53:30 am
I have just now created a very simple garage for further testing purposes with a mouse controlled main camera... I was wondering what we would need to have in the garage... this list is composed of stuff I've seen in the SR1,2 and Alpha version of SR3 as well as some of my own ideers...

ladder
car door
fire extingisher
posters
window
car tires
wrench
engine tuner
large hammer
car lift/under the car board/car jack
book
clock on wall
radio
tire stack
car paint spray thing
newspaper
alcohol
jerry cans
cardboard boxes
hamper
lots of smaller cans
desk/chest of drawers
fan
engine parts
tool plate on wall
car sign
paint cans
parts list
metal locker
drill
hand drill machine
4 way tire iron
tire rubber hose
harley
lamp
lots of shelves
posters
calender
switch
open garage door with highes
bucket
plants
table
tuning device

Currently my test scene has this...

table
wrench
drill
plants
jerry can
tire stack
tuning device
clock
car lift
test car

I have yet to write any code at all... It is only a stationary scene at this point...
I have had problems making some 3d models show up "in-game" whle others show u without problems... I have yet to find out why :)

Maybe you can post some screen shots some time?
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on July 26, 2014, 08:15:48 am
Her are some sceenshots

(http://s27.postimg.org/uppd7zjgv/sr3testscene1.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/uppd7zjgv/)

(http://s30.postimg.org/pd9r90clp/sr3testscene2.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/pd9r90clp/)

(http://s13.postimg.org/6295z2jmb/sr3testscene3.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/6295z2jmb/)
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on July 30, 2014, 01:04:12 pm
You know i have complete garage scene i could email to you.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on August 04, 2014, 12:10:36 pm
That would be great... I have still not mastered lighting in unity
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on August 17, 2014, 06:10:07 am
https://mega.co.nz/#!nkAXELrZ!uEq0-bdphtGcplQU-q8tSy4J3zuZvCClWCbTYdaWJgw
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on August 30, 2014, 02:00:32 am
https://mega.co.nz/#!nkAXELrZ!uEq0-bdphtGcplQU-q8tSy4J3zuZvCClWCbTYdaWJgw

I have been toying around with unity... it will not display all 3ds files when dragged on to the scene for some reason...

I will try to load the files at runtime instead... it seems that I need to convert the models to obj format in order for the free version to load the models at runtime

My initial goal will be to show the garage and a car that drives in to the garage

step 2 will be to be able to switch between two different cars where the first drives out and the second drives in ...etc...
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on September 03, 2014, 11:19:41 pm
I've heard talk that the Unreal Engine 4 is cross plat form as well as the tool kit/SDK and is cheaper and supposedly just as easy or almost just as easy as Unity 3D.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on September 04, 2014, 12:52:47 pm
Interesting, I will see if there is a free version of that engine.

I think we need something that is free to begin with. When we begin to have something, then we can begin to drop some coins if nessecery :)

I can also try to see what can be done with Irrlicht (I gained a little experience with irrlicht back in 2004) :)

I downloaded irrlicht (3d) and newton (physics) and the source code to a car racing game that uses both.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on September 07, 2014, 01:50:18 pm
It only cost money if you charge money for the game you make with it, so yes it is free.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLZlv_N0_O1gafGBkGkyB1JRFnUM2703YH (https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLZlv_N0_O1gafGBkGkyB1JRFnUM2703YH)

Irrlicht require skilled C++ coders every thing has to be done the old fashioned way hence Unity 3D however UE4 JUST now has been released a few months ago. They are trying to compete with Unity 3D.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on September 11, 2014, 03:59:37 pm
looks interesting  :)
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on September 14, 2014, 01:37:20 am
It does. Indeed, I think they are trying to compete with Unity 3D.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: Maxaxle on September 17, 2014, 12:22:56 am
Irrlichit has been around for longer, and its requirements might be lower.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on September 21, 2014, 06:58:44 pm
Irrlichit has been around for longer, and its requirements might be lower.

It requires years of C++ programing and computer/hardware understanding. IE you have to know how to program and we do NOT know how to program and if we did probably would not be very good at it.

Unity does most of the work and UE4 is supposed to be an in between but closer to unity.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: Maxaxle on September 22, 2014, 07:32:12 pm
I think I get what you mean.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on December 06, 2014, 02:16:37 pm
I just found an hour or so this weekend to make a quick test with just loading the garage 3ds model and exploring it using a fps cam

I should hopefully get some more time when the chrismas holidays are upon us.

The texture quality setting is set to low, but a high setting should fix the textures right up on the garage...

The "pink box" is the "collision box" for the car model

I think I can pull it off with irrlicht given enough time (which is my biggest problem atm)... After all, I DID get a bachelors degree in computer games programming back in 2007 ;) 

(http://s27.postimg.org/kwhga0rb3/sr3_exp_garage_very_first_garage_appear.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/kwhga0rb3/)
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on December 09, 2014, 01:09:28 am
I just found an hour or so this weekend to make a quick test with just loading the garage 3ds model and exploring it using a fps cam

I should hopefully get some more time when the chrismas holidays are upon us.

The texture quality setting is set to low, but a high setting should fix the textures right up on the garage...

The "pink box" is the "collision box" for the car model

I think I can pull it off with irrlicht given enough time (which is my biggest problem atm)... After all, I DID get a bachelors degree in computer games programming back in 2007 ;) 

([url]http://s27.postimg.org/kwhga0rb3/sr3_exp_garage_very_first_garage_appear.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://postimg.org/image/kwhga0rb3/[/url])


Wow.


one of the things i like about then ew Unreal engine and Unity 3D is people will less programming experience can still contribute HOWEVER things can be tweak with C or C# or C++, one of those 3. Sssoo if a or the 1 and only programmer(s) gets laid or caught up with life the hold project doesn't get halted. (Which the SR3 project knows oh so well) both Unity and Unreal engines build out in windows, OSX and Linux too.

-Multiplatform
-Coder friendly
-less/non Coder friendly
-Still fairly/mostly flexible
-fair licensing fees, free version and or free if you games is free. pay version no more than $2k USD

for and while and still as far as i know Unity was decided on but, i THINK given our position, nothing is TRULY set in stone just yet. Which could be a good thing as Unity 3D and Unreal are duking out it lately with new features and updates ever few months. (How cool would it be to have oculous rift support in SR3?)


EDIT: that pink box is actualy not the collision, at least if it's from my model, MrChris put that there several years back as a size scale for me, it represents a 1950 cadillac or something like that (i forget), which would be the biggest car in the game, since it's one of the biggest cars ever made. (at least in that time period IRL)

it's really cool to see that model loaded up in irrilicht. It's most definitely cool to see some development action going on. I've been dragging my feet on my writing/planning end. Been keeping an eye on Unreal and Unity plan to look up some how to videos. Also got a new job too. I hold this job fora while it COULD open some monetary opportunities for SR3, like a pro/paid for game engine if need among other possible costs. again i say COULD but, ifi can manage to save and manage my money well enough I care for SR3 enough to plop down some hard earned paychecks IF possible.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on December 12, 2014, 07:08:42 am
Ok, I must admit that I haven't yet begun to identify the various models within the 3ds file.
I just assumed it was a collisionbox because of its color and its placement :)

I forgot to mention that my quick test also incorporates the power of Newton and the power of TinyXML :)

Newton is a physics engine that is often used in conjuction with Irrlicht.

I used Irrlicht once before back in 2004 in an exam project.

I have used TinyXML back in 2011 in a project where I generated C code files based on an XML config file.

I will try to experiment with using the "no car" garage 3ds and then use my 32 ford roadster in 3ds format as the test car using the turbine wheels that I made... We need a lot of running gerar and engine parts models though...

My first goal will be to be able to have a car roll into the garage (using newton) when the "game" is launched.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on December 12, 2014, 10:47:08 am
Just fixed the texture thing and the project name and loaded the empty garage in to the project...

(http://s22.postimg.org/a9qy6wdf1/sr3_exp_garage_second_screenshot.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/a9qy6wdf1/)

regarding irrlicht & c++ & newton & tinyxml versus unity 3d ...

In unity3d you still need to make a fair amount of scripts... and your hands are tied in several areas for example regarding what 3d files you can import... you also have less control of the game code

I don't know about the unreal engine SDK... I havent spend much time with it yet

with irrlicht we might get some free extra attention from irrlicht and newton related websites if we used irrlicht and newton

I found something called irrnewt that should help integrate newton and irrlicht... I will look in to this too see if it offers something usefull...

I also have that sample project I can look in, that sample project is coded in c++ and uses irrlicht and newton just like this sr3 irrlicht project
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on December 13, 2014, 12:52:59 am
this might be my inexperience showing but, my under standing is that irrilicht already has the bullet physics engine incorporated already.

Unreal 4.x is supposed to allow you to manipulate the source code if you need but, also has unity like setup as well. With unity you can buy scripts, also supposedly you can get the source code access if you need but, i bet it's pricey and you only really get it if if your big name title attracting attention and business like Wasteland 2 did.

EDIT:

I need to make some time to look at Unreal Closer so far from the news articles and comments it's looking good, supposedly a bit more flexible than Unity.

And of course good old irrilicht, requires a lot of know how but, proven system, https://openmw.org/en/
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on December 13, 2014, 10:21:24 am
The bullet physics engine should be less sophisticated than Newton. Also with Newton I have som sample code to look at  8)
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on December 14, 2014, 09:23:53 am
New screenshot, I managed to get the 32 "parked" in the garage...

The 32 ford still needs A LOT of fin tuning... mainly regarding the textures

I dug it up from an old backup and I am not entirely sure that the model is the final one that I made for SR3... Like many others .. I did lose some files in a hdd crash some years ago.

The model I am guessing is from early 2005... While the final model was from about december 2005 IIRC.

(http://s17.postimg.org/ry7kqs2kr/sr3_exp_garage_third_screenshot.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/ry7kqs2kr/)

Next step, identify various parts of the 3ds model and use the wheel dummies to load and place the "turbine wheels" instead of the dummy wheels

Then, it will be time to figure out how to make the car "roll" in to the garage when the "game" starts.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on December 14, 2014, 08:18:04 pm
that might be an issue. for what standards we do define for the 3d models? the old SR3 standard are quite outdated. i wonder if can ad and change them as we go with out significant reprogramming being needed?
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on December 15, 2014, 02:34:54 am
Interesting point. In regards to 3d models, to begin with we can still use some of the old low poly models I think.

I did hit a roadblock though. It seems its all objects or nothing per 3ds file with iirlicht. I hope I find a workaround.

But then again there is also the ogre 3d engine
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on December 16, 2014, 12:18:20 am
i know orge is an offshoot of irrilicht.

What do you mean all objects or nothing? what is the definition of object or rather what defines and object? in the 3ds file(s) that is. i'm just trying to understand what you mean.

as a non coder for me a 3d file consist of meshes, textures, bones and or collision files. we all know collision files are usually not seen and used for physics, boned being similar but, used to position things like lights and animations or interlinking of models in the game or application.

All assuming what I just said makes sense and if it does is not a time consuming question to ask.

on similar/same note.

The software have these days could open some doors. like say what if some of the suspension parts moved with the wheels? would they need to be a certain kind of object or need specific names in the irrilicht or would we need to pace bones in the model? Same thing for lighting GPU power is good now never mind when SR3 comes out, thing about a car's interior would we use bones for all the light sources like the dash and accessory light as well as head lights and tails lights? Same for moving engine parts like radiator fans and stuff. ...as in we might consider these might thing we might want to implement later .... or odes that matter? I'm not coder, i do know that shouldn't matter for now since your just testing the waters atm, so to speak.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on December 16, 2014, 04:59:36 am
what I mean by object (as defined by zmodeler 1 I think?), is collections of meshes in the 3ds file..

for example I think of the front left wheel dummy as an object within the 3ds file...

What I want to achieve for now, is to be able to (with irrlicht) to

a) load a single 3ds file and

b)  then afterwards select for example the front left wheel dummy object

c) and then hide it,

d)  then I want to load another 3ds file that contains a wheel, lets call it testwheel.3ds

e) and then use the coordinates of the wheel dummy to place the wheel from testwheel.3ds

f) and then use the local axis of testwheel.3ds to "spin" the wheel while moving the car

spinning and rotating stuff like wheels, steering wheel, running gear parts etc, could be done simple by rotating them along their own local axis

So either I need to find out how to do this in irrlicht or else I will need to place all parts of a car in seperate 3ds files and then use a setup file instead of dummy objects to assemble the various meshes from the various 3ds files in to a car

the setup file would then need to contains something like this:

body, x, y, z position
steering wheel, x, y, z position
front left wheel, x, y, z position
front right wheel, x, y, z position
rear left wheel, x, y, z position
rear right wheel, x, y, z position
front left headlight, x, y, z position
front right headlight, x, y, z position
rear left taillight, x, y, z position
rear right taillight, x, y, z position
engineblock, x, y, z position
manifold, x, y, z position
enginefan, x, y, z position
etc etc

IF Irrlicht supports multiple objects within a single 3ds file, then most stuff could be handling using dummys within the cars 3ds file...

Anything that can be replaced or moved in some way or have some other function like lights would need dummy objects

The other option to have a bunch of 3ds files would also work and might make it easier to be able to replace body parts like doors etc... I was thinking that it could be kind of cool if it was possible to for example replace the left and right rear fenders with other types... like one set of fenders could have "wings" and another set could have no wings... stuff like that (like in Gearhead Garage )
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on December 18, 2014, 06:11:02 am
According to http://irrlicht.sourceforge.net/forum//viewtopic.php?f=4&t=16632&hilit=3ds+multiple+objects (http://irrlicht.sourceforge.net/forum//viewtopic.php?f=4&t=16632&hilit=3ds+multiple+objects)

then it IS possible to seperate multiple meshes/objects within a 3ds file, but it must be done using index instead of names...

I will experiment with this...

Perhaps if object names are loaded sequentially according to name,

then we can atleast know what is what if we have a fixed set of dummy objects/meshes that all start with Z

(assuming none of the additional objects/meshes use names that begin with a Z)

This unfortunatly disallows adding additional car specific named dummy objects, that is, all cars must have the same maximum set of dummy objects since the index of each dummy object is then hard coded,

A workaround for this issue could be a combination model (that is both dummy objects within main 3ds file as well as seperate objects controlled by configuration file) where additional non standard car parts are placed in seperate 3ds files along with a location, and behaviour, configuration for each car that supports the use of that particular part...

To answer your question from earlier...

that might be an issue. for what standards we do define for the 3d models? the old SR3 standard are quite outdated. i wonder if can ad and change them as we go with out significant reprogramming being needed?


Yes, we should be able to change the models without too much hassle... Irrlicht should not care too much about what poly count a model has.

So this should pretty much allow for drop in replacement models that are much more detailed and much more realistic.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on December 20, 2014, 04:50:18 am
Seems to be limitations that come from the 3d file formats. .. I will attempt to use an xml file to store object names... that way everything can still be contained in a single 3ds file if needed.

It seems the aux format of the prev sr3 was very clever made... both protection of art as well as objects with names were build-in
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on December 20, 2014, 11:12:19 pm
what I mean by object (as defined by zmodeler 1 I think?), is collections of meshes in the 3ds file..

for example I think of the front left wheel dummy as an object within the 3ds file...

What I want to achieve for now, is to be able to (with irrlicht) to

a) load a single 3ds file and

b)  then afterwards select for example the front left wheel dummy object

c) and then hide it,

d)  then I want to load another 3ds file that contains a wheel, lets call it testwheel.3ds

e) and then use the coordinates of the wheel dummy to place the wheel from testwheel.3ds

f) and then use the local axis of testwheel.3ds to "spin" the wheel while moving the car

spinning and rotating stuff like wheels, steering wheel, running gear parts etc, could be done simple by rotating them along their own local axis

So either I need to find out how to do this in irrlicht or else I will need to place all parts of a car in seperate 3ds files and then use a setup file instead of dummy objects to assemble the various meshes from the various 3ds files in to a car

the setup file would then need to contains something like this:

body, x, y, z position
steering wheel, x, y, z position
front left wheel, x, y, z position
front right wheel, x, y, z position
rear left wheel, x, y, z position
rear right wheel, x, y, z position
front left headlight, x, y, z position
front right headlight, x, y, z position
rear left taillight, x, y, z position
rear right taillight, x, y, z position
engineblock, x, y, z position
manifold, x, y, z position
enginefan, x, y, z position
etc etc

IF Irrlicht supports multiple objects within a single 3ds file, then most stuff could be handling using dummys within the cars 3ds file...

Anything that can be replaced or moved in some way or have some other function like lights would need dummy objects

The other option to have a bunch of 3ds files would also work and might make it easier to be able to replace body parts like doors etc... I was thinking that it could be kind of cool if it was possible to for example replace the left and right rear fenders with other types... like one set of fenders could have "wings" and another set could have no wings... stuff like that (like in Gearhead Garage )

lets simply that. in GTA series, the car mesh have no wheels and bone in stead. so need to hide the wheel, just load in the desired wheel model.

ACTUALLY ...... i think damn it's been so many, year. i think the model has like 1 rear wheel, then it's duplicated but, that's retarded. I like the above idea better because i seem to think i'm talking about. (i probably don't  :P   )

if that can be accomplished car model would consist of less meshes and more bone, and every thing in else in different 3d files, and loaded in. the stock parts and or options and all the meshes and texture could be dropped in a folder or compressed file or whatever. (again i might be talking crazy here)

I wonder if Hellmark has the source and or more information on the old AUX format.

Also i don't mean changing out models, i mean how the game handles them. sort of like. I mean like weather or not we uses bones for wheel and part locations or just objects names etc etc, would such change require vast rewriting of code?
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on December 21, 2014, 08:03:15 am
I wonder if Hellmark has the source and or more information on the old AUX format.

Also i don't mean changing out models, i mean how the game handles them. sort of like. I mean like weather or not we uses bones for wheel and part locations or just objects names etc etc, would such change require vast rewriting of code?

I found the source code for version 0.4.4.1 ( streetrod3-src_0.4.4.1 ) on an old hdd backup.

I will try to see if it compiles in visual c++ 2008 express

If not then I might still be able to use lots of stuff like the 3ds format code (since it is also coded in c++)

I think that we would need some re-coding if we decided to switch from dummy objects to bones... but the more modular the code is, the easier it is to change stuff.

I think I might be able to make the car driving into the garage animation during the holidays...

I have been improving the test wheel slightly ( I decided not to use the turbine wheel for testing)

I now have the car in the garage with 4 "custom" wheels attached.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on December 22, 2014, 09:15:47 pm
I wonder if Hellmark has the source and or more information on the old AUX format.

Also i don't mean changing out models, i mean how the game handles them. sort of like. I mean like weather or not we uses bones for wheel and part locations or just objects names etc etc, would such change require vast rewriting of code?

I found the source code for version 0.4.4.1 ( streetrod3-src_0.4.4.1 ) on an old hdd backup.

I will try to see if it compiles in visual c++ 2008 express

If not then I might still be able to use lots of stuff like the 3ds format code (since it is also coded in c++)

I think that we would need some re-coding if we decided to switch from dummy objects to bones... but the more modular the code is, the easier it is to change stuff.

I think I might be able to make the car driving into the garage animation during the holidays...

I have been improving the test wheel slightly ( I decided not to use the turbine wheel for testing)

I now have the car in the garage with 4 "custom" wheels attached.

would doing both dummy objects AND bones be allow us more freedom? would that make any since or is that stupid talk?

Wheel? like a steering wheel?
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on December 23, 2014, 07:51:25 am
Irrlicht does support bones animation.  Both animation that is part of the model and custom is supported.

I dont have experience with bones animation but it should be possible to make it work.

I think it could make sense to use both types I guess if we
can actually call dummy objects for an animation type.

but we can use both. Some stuff might work best one way and other stuff might work better another way

I mainly think of charecter animation when talking about bones.

with wheel I talk about rims and tires

I currently have an animation where the car enters the garage upon start of the "game"
It still lacks wheel animation though.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on December 24, 2014, 12:27:57 am
that's what i'm thinking as we progress some things may better suited for bones and others for dummy objects. my memory fails me but, i almost remember GTA series using both as well. GTA series being of the games i spent more time doing in depth modding for and learning how it worked.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on December 24, 2014, 02:58:30 am
Sounds good.

I am tempted to try and see if I can use quake 2 models as "drivers" for the cars :)

I think that we will need to create a game that is even closer to the look and feel of sr1 and sr2 than the previous sr3 versions were.... (like car entering garage, drivers for the cars, popping the hood to work on the engine etc)

I have wheel animation at this point but the wheels spin in the wrong diirection no matter if I manipulate the X, Y or Z axis so I need to figure out why that is.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on December 26, 2014, 01:10:47 pm
Sounds good.

I am tempted to try and see if I can use quake 2 models as "drivers" for the cars :)

I think that we will need to create a game that is even closer to the look and feel of sr1 and sr2 than the previous sr3 versions were.... (like car entering garage, drivers for the cars, popping the hood to work on the engine etc)

I have wheel animation at this point but the wheels spin in the wrong direction no matter if I manipulate the X, Y or Z axis so I need to figure out why that is.

all of that was intended but, never came to fruition since it was merely a glorified tech demo any ways. it shouldn't be to hard to keep the original feel of the originals. with SR3 less should end up being more but, i guess that sounds kind of crazy without understanding the meaning behind it but, basically with sr 1 and 2 being "simple" games and years  of planning the hardest part will be actually making the game.  :P
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on December 28, 2014, 02:38:00 pm
youtube video of start animation

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLfGanjfwl4&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLfGanjfwl4&feature=youtu.be)

now with correct wheel rotations
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on December 28, 2014, 11:17:23 pm
youtube video of start animation

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLfGanjfwl4&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLfGanjfwl4&feature=youtu.be)

now with correct wheel rotations

cool!!!! now can you make it work on linux?  :P
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on December 29, 2014, 03:39:25 am
I think it should work on linux if GCC for linux will compile it. I am not using any OS specific stuff.

The 32 and the wheels still looks like hell but it is because I have not yet ben putting textures on them
( as you might remember, in the old alpha the textures were not mapped in the aux file,
  but in a seperate file :) )

I will make another attempt at getting the old SR3 code to compile though, since there has already been put a lot of work in the previous alpha code.

Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on December 29, 2014, 11:01:09 am
wouldn't it make more sense to have have the textures mapped in the 3d file what ever it may be? or am i mistaken or confused about something? normally when i think texture mapping i'm thinking the file that holds the coordinates for the vertices also hold the mapping for the textures. i'd think it would make things simpler for the artists having it all in 3ds or 3d file? or is there a big benefit?
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on December 29, 2014, 01:52:04 pm
I am not sure if one way is better than the other ... I guess from a modelers point of view its best to include mapping in the 3d file like with irrlicht and various formats like 3ds. But I think the 3ds max exporter generated a special data file automatically based on model data from 3ds max? But what I remember is that it was possible to alter texture mapping by changing the data files but without altering or opening the file that contained the model itself.

if I remember correctly the alpha version 0.4.4.1 used xml files to hold texture info about the models
while the aux files only contained model data... I will double check this and post my findings.

GOOD NEWS! I have changed the code (to remove compile errors) in the OLD alpha 0.4.4.1 so that it now COMPILES with the FREE VERSION of visual c++ 2008 EXPRESS... AND. .. THE ....RESULTING.... SR3 EXE ... IT ... RUNS ...

It was mainly a question of some of the commands being depricated or some shorthand coding that Visual Studio 2008 did not accept :) :) :)

Also... it turns out that the project is well structured now that I figured out what file to open in the IDE (D'OH)  :) I think I MIGHT be able....

to make some more changes to the source of the old / current ALPHA 0.4.4.1 :) :) :) :)

I am currently trying to fix the bug with the wheels placed at a clockwise rotation when the car is on the track

A little CS theory...

every language is ruled by a BNF.  Each compiler must  comply to that BNF in order to compile code

A BNF is the formal mathematical definition (a set of rules) of the syntax and semantics of a programming language

So every c++ compiler follows the same BNF more or less. But some are less strict than others regarding semantic rules

The previous compiler tolerated some stuff that visual c++ 2008 does not but the changes still allows to old compiler to compile the project because they must both use the same basic BNF in order to be c++ compilers

I had to fix the following...

variable scopes
missing typecasts
a missing header file (I found a free implementation of that file on google)

One of my previous jobs was teaching computer science at a local university college.

----

just looked at the old alpha... each car has a car.aux and a car.mat

the mat file is an xml like file tha contains info about texture mapping... here is the car.mat from my old 32 ford model:

NotPaint {
   Pass1 {
      Texture CAR01.TGA
   }
}

Window {
   Pass1 {
      RGB 0.900027, 0.900027, 0.900027
      Alpha 0.500000
      Blend b_alpha
   }
}

Window2 {
   Pass1 {
      RGB 0.070588, 0.070588, 0.070588
      Alpha 0.500000
      Blend b_alpha
   }
}

CarMaterial {
Pass1 {
TcGen tc_sphere
Texture envmap.bmp
}

Pass2 {

RGB 1,0,0

Alpha 0.75

Blend b_alpha

backcull false

}

}

Dials {
   Pass1 {
      Texture Dash00.tga
   }
}

Fabric_Tan_Carpet {
   Pass1 {
      Texture seat.tga
   }
}

Grey {
   Pass1 {
      Texture grey.tga
   }
}

ShinyMetal {
   Pass1 {
      TcGen tc_sphere
      Texture chrome.bmp
   }
   Pass2 {
      Texture grey.bmp
      Alpha 0.75
      Blend b_alpha
   }
}

keyhead {
   Pass1 {
      RGB 0.000000, 0.435294, 0.192157
   }
}

keyhanger {
   Pass1 {
      RGB 0.266667, 0.192157, 0.545098
   }
}

pedal {
   Pass1 {
      RGB 0.131373, 0.052941, 0.162745
   }
}

steeringwh {
   Pass1 {
      RGB 0.545098, 0.266667, 0.192157
   }
}

Black {
   Pass1 {
      Texture BLACK.TGA
   }
}

Mirror {
Pass1 {
TcGen tc_sphere
Texture envmap.bmp
}

Pass2 {
RGB 0.533333,0.533333,0.533333
Alpha 0.75
Blend b_alpha
backcull false
}
}

Bulb {
   Pass1 {
      RGB 0.770588, 0.000588, 0.000588
   }
}
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on December 31, 2014, 12:36:55 am
I am not sure if one way is better than the other ... I guess from a modelers point of view its best to include mapping in the 3d file like with irrlicht and various formats like 3ds. But I think the 3ds max exporter generated a special data file automatically based on model data from 3ds max? But what I remember is that it was possible to alter texture mapping by changing the data files but without altering or opening the file that contained the model itself.

if I remember correctly the alpha version 0.4.4.1 used xml files to hold texture info about the models
while the aux files only contained model data... I will double check this and post my findings.

GOOD NEWS! I have changed the code (to remove compile errors) in the OLD alpha 0.4.4.1 so that it now COMPILES with the FREE VERSION of visual c++ 2008 EXPRESS... AND. .. THE ....RESULTING.... SR3 EXE ... IT ... RUNS ...

It was mainly a question of some of the commands being depricated or some shorthand coding that Visual Studio 2008 did not accept :) :) :)

Also... it turns out that the project is well structured now that I figured out what file to open in the IDE (D'OH)  :) I think I MIGHT be able....

to make some more changes to the source of the old / current ALPHA 0.4.4.1 :) :) :) :)

I am currently trying to fix the bug with the wheels placed at a clockwise rotation when the car is on the track

A little CS theory...

every language is ruled by a BNF.  Each compiler must  comply to that BNF in order to compile code

A BNF is the formal mathematical definition (a set of rules) of the syntax and semantics of a programming language

So every c++ compiler follows the same BNF more or less. But some are less strict than others regarding semantic rules

The previous compiler tolerated some stuff that visual c++ 2008 does not but the changes still allows to old compiler to compile the project because they must both use the same basic BNF in order to be c++ compilers

I had to fix the following...

variable scopes
missing typecasts
a missing header file (I found a free implementation of that file on google)

One of my previous jobs was teaching computer science at a local university college.

----

just looked at the old alpha... each car has a car.aux and a car.mat

the mat file is an xml like file tha contains info about texture mapping... here is the car.mat from my old 32 ford model:

NotPaint {
   Pass1 {
      Texture CAR01.TGA
   }
}

Window {
   Pass1 {
      RGB 0.900027, 0.900027, 0.900027
      Alpha 0.500000
      Blend b_alpha
   }
}

Window2 {
   Pass1 {
      RGB 0.070588, 0.070588, 0.070588
      Alpha 0.500000
      Blend b_alpha
   }
}

CarMaterial {
Pass1 {
TcGen tc_sphere
Texture envmap.bmp
}

Pass2 {

RGB 1,0,0

Alpha 0.75

Blend b_alpha

backcull false

}

}

Dials {
   Pass1 {
      Texture Dash00.tga
   }
}

Fabric_Tan_Carpet {
   Pass1 {
      Texture seat.tga
   }
}

Grey {
   Pass1 {
      Texture grey.tga
   }
}

ShinyMetal {
   Pass1 {
      TcGen tc_sphere
      Texture chrome.bmp
   }
   Pass2 {
      Texture grey.bmp
      Alpha 0.75
      Blend b_alpha
   }
}

keyhead {
   Pass1 {
      RGB 0.000000, 0.435294, 0.192157
   }
}

keyhanger {
   Pass1 {
      RGB 0.266667, 0.192157, 0.545098
   }
}

pedal {
   Pass1 {
      RGB 0.131373, 0.052941, 0.162745
   }
}

steeringwh {
   Pass1 {
      RGB 0.545098, 0.266667, 0.192157
   }
}

Black {
   Pass1 {
      Texture BLACK.TGA
   }
}

Mirror {
Pass1 {
TcGen tc_sphere
Texture envmap.bmp
}

Pass2 {
RGB 0.533333,0.533333,0.533333
Alpha 0.75
Blend b_alpha
backcull false
}
}

Bulb {
   Pass1 {
      RGB 0.770588, 0.000588, 0.000588
   }
}

So basically the BNF is programing language as Strunk and White rules (Grammar, punctuation and spelling) are to the English language?

What would be the point of altering the mapping? doing it on the fly?
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on December 31, 2014, 06:29:25 am
Well altering the mapping on the fly would be something tha would be done from inside the game and would require some sort of system to determine what textures to use.

I am not sure what the point woould be, I used the part.mat files to create various versions of existing parts in the old sr3 alpha... such as for example variations of the kelsey hayes wire wheel in various colors and with various decorations (whitewall, text, etc)
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on January 01, 2015, 03:17:20 am
Happy new year to everybody.

Hopefully I will gain some more practical knowhow about 3d game creation this year. I do have a degree but I have always been tempted by and chosen other types of  IT jobs such as embedded software development.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on January 01, 2015, 03:20:47 am
Happy new year.

and yeah i guess that makes sense to experiment with some of that and to pull in existing sr3 models.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on January 02, 2015, 12:40:44 pm
Yes.

Are any of the other coders still active or whats their status?

So basically the BNF is programing language as Strunk and White rules (Grammar, punctuation and spelling) are to the English language?

Yes.

Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: cdoublejj on January 02, 2015, 05:49:41 pm
Yes.

Are any of the other coders still active or whats their status?

So basically the BNF is programing language as Strunk and White rules (Grammar, punctuation and spelling) are to the English language?

Yes.

some of them hang out in our IRC form time to time. at this point in time i don't think any one is where you and are going back forth while you play with the code. I believe some time last year or late 2012 Giszo got irrilicht running in linux ... or was it the old alpha? i think he posted about it on THESE forums. We still need a back of the old forums for an archive section.


EDIT: I should mention Venomous will be away from the computer/internet for about a week or two.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: giszo on January 04, 2015, 04:21:32 am
and yeah i guess that makes sense to experiment with some of that and to pull in existing sr3 models.

Pulling in the existing SR3 models is not a trivial task as those are in a custom SR3 format and none of the existing engines (including Irrlicht) have a loader for them, meaning that the first task is to write a loader for those .aux files if you want to use them.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: giszo on January 04, 2015, 04:27:09 am
@TSJ I am also willing to spend my free time on some SR3 coding if you are also interested. Contact me through IRC, GTalk/Hangouts (my e-mail address is on my profile or drop me a PM if you can't see it). I also have Skype, Facebook, etc. if you're interested. This way we could have a short discussion session about plans and such. :-)
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on January 06, 2015, 01:47:27 pm
@TSJ I am also willing to spend my free time on some SR3 coding if you are also interested. Contact me through IRC, GTalk/Hangouts (my e-mail address is on my profile or drop me a PM if you can't see it). I also have Skype, Facebook, etc. if you're interested. This way we could have a short discussion session about plans and such. :-)

Sounds very cool :)

Atm we don't have anything really usefull,
I have limited spare time due to cats, wife, a child and a very long drive to and from work :)

My status is this...

I was able to compile the code from the old alpha in visual c++ 2008 and
I made a very small experiment with making a 3ds model "drive" in to the garage and
last I spend time on the project I had begun making some skeleton classes for representation of the car and its various parts.

:)

My local time zone is GMT+1
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: giszo on January 07, 2015, 02:40:54 am
A long time ago I was also able to compile the old sources under Linux with GCC, and it was working fine more or less... :)

My timezone is also GMT+1 as I am from Hungary.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: Vaelor on January 07, 2015, 11:55:24 am
Hello all! And Happy New Year 2015!! =)

As cdouble mentioned I am away from my PC for a little while as I go through a horrific holiday season house move (if you ever decide to move house at the end of December, just DON'T, mmkay?) so I'm not hanging out in IRC. I still use Facebook though, and most of you have added me there. If you don't, PM me and I'll add you ASAP.

Anyhow, glad to see that the forums aren't dead and that people are still interested in our little project! I think 2015 is going to be our year, we have a few things on the drawing board that should provide the funding we desperately need to get people really working on SR3. Because let's be honest, nobody really wants to work hard for free, no matter how passionate they are about the project. Even cdouble hasn't mentioned it in a while, and he's been around longer than any of the current members, myself included!!

Anyways, just wanted to check in and say hi and thanks for your continued interest guys. Hopefully I'll catch some of you on Facebook, or in our chat room when I get settled in to my new digs! =)

Cheers!
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on January 07, 2015, 01:25:29 pm
Pulling in the existing SR3 models is not a trivial task as those are in a custom SR3 format and none of the existing engines (including Irrlicht) have a loader for them, meaning that the first task is to write a loader for those .aux files if you want to use them.

true, but I think that we should have some minimum game functionality before writing a custom  aux importer.

I was thinking something along the lines of this...

1) Basic: setting up basic stuff like data structures for cars and everything else
2) Garage: starting with the Garage/Gearhead/GHG stuff
3) Scenes: stuff like gas tank, diner, junkyard, dealership, city
4) Racing: the actual racing stuff, physics, racing logic.
5) Misc: everything else :)

I want to add deeper car customization than what we had in the previous alpha... for example we should be able to change crankshaft and oilpan, we should be able to change the side view mirror, we should be able to change interior stuff like gauges, seats etc...

A big part of SR1 and 2 was also the ability to customize a car beyond pure performance stuff, I think here of the stickers and the cars color, I just want to take that a step further with the new SR3 :)

Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on January 07, 2015, 01:27:52 pm
Hello all! And Happy New Year 2015!! =)

As cdouble mentioned I am away from my PC for a little while as I go through a horrific holiday season house move

Happy new year to you also :)

I wish you good luck with the house move.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: giszo on January 08, 2015, 02:02:45 am
@TSJ: I saw you already made some progress with the garage. Did you continue the old (alpha) codebase or started something new from scratch?
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on January 08, 2015, 02:29:54 pm
My little experiment is done in c++ from scratch using irrlicht, a garage model provided by cdoublejj and a carmodel that I worked on for the old alpha.

We could also continue on the old alpha code instead if you wish. It has some bugs that need to be sorted:

1) the wheels are placed in incorrect order when racing compared to when the car is in the garage
2) some engine parts are not shown when racing
3) stickers are not shown when racing
4) engine parts have no influence on performance
5) opponents car parts are not randomized

I have been trying to fix 1) in the old alpha but so far no luck... I did switched the wheels around so that they were placed correctly but then some of them were oriented the wrong way (hubcab was facing the car side)  and the "front wheels" were suddently front left and rear left wheels instead of front left and front right wheel... I have not yet found a way around that... :)

did you get my mail and my PM's?
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: giszo on January 08, 2015, 02:41:32 pm
I don't think trying to continue the development on the old codebase is a good idea ... :)

I got your PM here, I'll send you a mail right now.
Title: Re: contents of garage
Post by: TSJ on January 10, 2015, 12:17:14 pm
I got your mail. And I agree.